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Thread: Military Spouse denied entry to Ft. Bragg Officer Spouse Club...

  1. Eye
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    #21
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    Signed petition and shared it with my 590 FB friends, hopefully it will go from 65 signatures to 1,000s! Thanks for share this. I'm kind of pissed about this now.
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    #22
    You are 100% wrong about DOMA. This is a private club and not the government. DOMA thus doesn't apply in any way whatsoever.

    You clearly don't know what DOMA is or what it does exactly. It's a law that goes over all other federal laws and makes the terms "spouse" and "marriage" only apply to opposite-sex couples. It doesn't mean "same-sex couples can't under any circumstances receive any benefits", but only affects benefits that are specifically granted by other laws. So even though this club may be officially sponsored by the military DOMA still doesn't apply. It would only apply if there were a law that regulated the creation and operation of Officer Spouse Clubs. A lot of military benefits are governed by law, but not all. For example the DoD could chose on its own to give ID cards to same-sex spouses, or give them command sponsorship in foreign countries, or co-locate dual military same-sex couples. Those are benefits that are only regulated by internal DoD regulations.

    That can also be seen with the State Department for example. If a gay foreign service officer is stationed in another country, their spouse can accompany them and will receive support and access to facilities there. All completely legal despite DOMA. They did this simply by changing internal rules. In the military most benefits are determined by law so this is harder, but there is more that the DoD could do even within the confines of the law.

    It's a horrible law that will be declared unconstitutional by June 2013, but it's not as all-encompassing as many of you think
    Last edited by Steve; 12-11-2012 at 03:29 PM.
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    #23
    Guns, actually the US Supreme Court just decided to hear two cases on whether DOMA is constitutional, so we may have this answered within a year.
    Steve, you are wrong. The club is not a private club. It uses government facilities, on a military base, and I believe it receives government support and funding. That takes it out of the "Private club" excuse.
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    #24
    @Guynavywife
    That still doesn't mean DOMA applies. Unless the club's function is written down in a law it doesn't apply. It doesn't matter whether it uses government resources - as said there are federal agencies that provide benefits to same-sex partners. There already have been same-sex weddings on bases. According your logic those would be illegal as well. They aren't.

    The benefit situation is only so bad for the military because most military benefits are regulated by law, whereas many other government departments don't have specific laws but rely more on internal regulations. So DOMA applies disproportionately to the military, but even then it doesn't affect everything. There are things here and there the DoD could do on its own. They are saying that they are studying it, but nothing is happening.
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    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    You are 100% wrong about DOMA. This is a private club and not the government. DOMA thus doesn't apply in any way whatsoever.

    You clearly don't know what DOMA is or what it does exactly. It's a law that goes over all other federal laws and makes the terms "spouse" and "marriage" only apply to opposite-sex couples. It doesn't mean "same-sex couples can't under any circumstances receive any benefits", but only affects benefits that are specifically granted by other laws. So even though this club may be officially sponsored by the military DOMA still doesn't apply. It would only apply if there were a law that regulated the creation and operation of Officer Spouse Clubs. A lot of military benefits are governed by law, but not all. For example the DoD could chose on its own to give ID cards to same-sex spouses, or give them command sponsorship in foreign countries, or co-locate dual military same-sex couples. Those are benefits that are only regulated by internal DoD regulations.

    That can also be seen with the State Department for example. If a gay foreign service officer is stationed in another country, their spouse can accompany them and will receive support and access to facilities there. All completely legal despite DOMA. They did this simply by changing internal rules. In the military most benefits are determined by law so this is harder, but there is more that the DoD could do even within the confines of the law.

    It's a horrible law that will be declared unconstitutional by June 2013, but it's not as all-encompassing as many of you think
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve View Post
    @Guynavywife
    That still doesn't mean DOMA applies. Unless its function is written down in a law it doesn't. It doesn't matter whether it uses government resources - as said there are federal agencies that provide benefits to same-sex partners. There are already have been same-sex weddings on bases. According your logic those would be illegal as well. They aren't.

    The benefit situation is only so bad for the military because most military benefits are regulated by law, whereas many other government departments don't have specific laws but rely more on internal regulations. So DOMA applies disproportionately to the military, but even then it doesn't affect everything. There are things here and there the DoD could do on its own. They are saying that they are studying it, but nothing is happening.
    You choose this thread & these 2 posts as your first? Yea, uh, hi... welcome.

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    #26
    It makes me sad that this spouse doesn't get the same support I get. This is a hard lifestyle. I need the FRG and support of the Army to do it. I cannot imagine being treated like that. I hope that the group decides to discontinue this policy. I hope the publicity from this helps Americans see how big the problem really is. I also applaud her for her strength in starting this, she is brave!

    I do really hope the Supreme Court makes a big ruling on this so the issue can be laid to rest. If the state allows same sex marriage the federal government should recognize it. Until the Supreme Court comes out and says, yes, same sex marriage is legal, we are going to have fight after fight on this. It is an issue that is not going away. The more time we take to say it isnt constitutional the longer we are wasting our time and tax payer money on litigation of it.


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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Eye View Post
    Signed petition and shared it with my 590 FB friends, hopefully it will go from 65 signatures to 1,000s! Thanks for share this. I'm kind of pissed about this now.
    I also signed and shared .

    When I signed I was #101, so we are already making progress from #65!


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    yeah, after a very long time of not using it I am trying to blog again!
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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by gunsgirl View Post
    Almost all legal Spouses associations have a standard policy of not allowing non-legal dependants JOIN, they can participate they can vollenteer, but they cannot pay dues or vote.
    FRG's are unit based groups, do not have by laws, do not have dues and therefore legally can have anyone they want "join" thier group.
    You are very very wrong. The FRG's DO have bylaws. As FRG vice president I had to attend training and meet with people over at Fleet and Family every year when we would rewrite our bylaws and go over them.
    Now I lay me down to sleep, a bottle of vodka at my feet. If I die before I wake, tell my friends I drank it straight






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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by BraveLilToaster View Post
    You are very very wrong. The FRG's DO have bylaws. As FRG vice president I had to attend training and meet with people over at Fleet and Family every year when we would rewrite our bylaws and go over them.
    missed gunsgirl's post - but yes, FRG's do have bylaws and rules out the wazoo!
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